I just wish the United States had as low a homicide rate -- and as low a rate of deaths from terrorism -- as does Israel. And I wish that the United States took every such death as seriously as Israel does. :( :(
Most homicides in the USA is criminals on criminals. Usually gangs hotting other gang members. Not a real loss. The terrorism and the Leftists who enable them is a Holocaust happening.
You win the internet for the most bigoted ignorant insensitive comment of the day. On Yom HaShoah you blame the victims of violent crime. And it is not the Lefists who are promoting the availability of guns to any murderer or terrorist wannabe. Medinat Yisrael knows better than to allow such; you and Americans don't.
There are no words. My sister said she's been to their house for Shabbat meals. Just a senseless, horrible tragedy. The girls' father told the news that he has been having nightmares while sleeping and wakes up to a reality that was worse than the nightmare. I can't even imagine his pain. I read that and hugged my boys tightly. Hamakom yenachem otam.
Raging about Arabs is pointless. So is pondering solutions devoid of clinging to our traditions. It is not about them. It is about us, collectively. Seems like ancient history today, but the below famous story is more appropriate than ever. Sadly, also very timely. Consider, the next time someone claims a mechallel Shabbos or chometz-eater on Pesach in the army is doing more for the Jews than those loyal to our traditions.
by Jonathan Rosenblum, Jerusalem Post, July 28, 2000
Salah Tamari, a former Palestinian terrorist told Israeli journalist Aharon Barnea of the complete transformation he underwent in an Israeli prison. While in prison, he had completely despaired of any hope that the Palestinians would one day realize any of their territorial dreams, and so he was ready to renounce the struggle.
Then, one Pesach, he witnessed his Jewish warder eating a pita sandwich. Tamari was shocked, and asked his jailer how he could so unashamedly eat bread on Pesach.
The Jew replied: 'I feel no obligation to events that took place over 2,000 years ago. I have no connection to that.'
That entire night Tamari could not sleep. He thought to himself: 'A nation whose members have no connection to their past, and are capable of so openly transgressing their most important laws - that nation has cut off all its roots to the Land.'
He concluded that the Palestinians could, in fact, achieve all their goals. From that moment, he determined 'to fight for everything - not a percentage, not such crumbs as the Israelis might throw us - but for everything. Because opposing us is a nation that has no connection to its roots, which are no longer of interest to it.'
Tamari goes on to relate how he shared this insight with 'tens of thousands of his colleagues, and all were convinced.'
THE severance of connection to a Jewish past is one of the chief goals of the branja (clique), which, as alarmingly described by Yoram Hazony in his book, The Jewish State: The Struggle for Israel's Soul, dominates Israeli intellectual life, and whose influence is felt in every sphere - education, the military, and the judiciary.
But that article was from nearly 25 years ago, describing an event many years before that. Israel has grown more religious and right wing since then. Many more Jews now DO feel the connection to the past.
Of course, us religious Jews have a different problem from the left, and that's this sense of fatalism, that God is in control so it doesn't really matter what we do anyway. This has always been our Achilles Heel, and the reason why it was the left, and not the right, who built Israel and laid the foundation for so many other Jewish institutions.
So. It more applicable today. The problems are worse. It's not just about non-observant Jews munching on chometz when they shouldn't. Even "connected" Jews reject our roots. This blog's continued existence is a testament to this fact.
Shaarei Teshuva, Gate 3:160 (translation by Feldheim): "The aspect of "haters of Hashem" can also be found at times among those who perform mitzvos and are scrupulous in avoiding sin, both in deed and in speech -- if they are pained and inwardly troubled when their friends engage in Torah study, and it bothers them when others serve Hashem and fear Him."
Agreed that even religious people don't always feel their roots, but I dont agree that it has relevance here. Jews in Israel are much, MUCH more connected to tradition than they were in the 1970s or 80s when the (individual) story described in the article took place.
No relevance here? Natan says a mechallel Shabbos (or, equivalently, a chometz eater on Pesach) in the army does more for Klal Yisrael than the Shomer Shabbos avrech in kollel. This is a stance that applies for all time, not just now. He would have said the same about the pita eater decades ago. Yet, that pita eater inspired all the Arab activity to this very day. That is relevant. The only way to undo that is to embrace the entirety of our heritage.
I pray Natan has his own sleepless night followed by a similarly powerful transformation, and choose to cease being counted among the Haters of Hashem.
I meant the story was "not relevant" only in the sense that Israelis as a whole are now more in touch with their roots, and so the story with the prison guard is no longer representative.
Also, it may be a story of one man, but it is not an individual story. By his own words, he influenced thousands to harden their hearts and take their war to the next level, and everything that has occurred since is due to that one incident.
Meanwhile, limud Torah, "kneged kulam," is an embarrassment at best to people like Natan. He is no different from a m'challel Shabbos in their impact. Even more so as a public figure who spouts odious opinions.
RNS does not practise what he preaches - he is sending (incidentally, what does that mean? Isn't his son old enough to make his own decisions?) his son to a hesder yeshiva!! So instead of serving the full 3 years his son will only be serving less than 18 months, in order to learn in yeshiva. Doesn't he think it unfair that he will not be "sharing the burden equally" with his non religious brothers? After all, according to RNS, the only justification for full time Torah study is in order to teach, and hesder yeshiva graduates don't usually become rabbinic teachers when they complete their truncated military service.....
It is events like these that highlight the advantage of the mystical approach. I for one believe that such tragedies have deeper meaning and Hashem has a plan for all of us. מי שמאמין לא מפחד.
In contrast, the rationalist approach looks like tragedies like this as mere coincidence or happenstance. And that loss of meaning is in itself an additional tragedy.
What plan is that? Is it the same one that gave us churban bayit rishon, churban bayit shayni, multiple holy inquisitions, the holocaust, to mention just a few of Hashem’s monstrous exterminations. Yeah, there must be a deeper meaning. Let me know what it is when his next carnage smacks you in the face.
If I were you, I’d put my trust in someone other than an entity that kills you every time he feels that he’s been disrespected.
Yeah, that one. The one that also gave me my life, my wife, my beautiful kids, my Parnassus, my anything and everything, and ultimate reward both in this world and the next.
Stories like these are so heartbreaking and frustrating I prefer to switch of Israeli news
On a side point, I may be a British Jew who has to put up with the stream of anti Israeli sentiment in the UK press from even so called neutral papers but to me the Isralei hasbara/PR is woeful
Every time one of these attacks happens the UK press refer to settlements, occupation, apartheid, Al Aksa provocations, etc as if they are to be expected or even tolerated!
Even the BBC stoop to such depths, for example referring to the Paley murders in Ramot being a "settlement in East Jerusalem" (absolute lies)!
About time we called a spade and spade and reiterated one message and one message only:
"There are many Palestinian Muslims who would like to leave in peace alongside their Jewish companions. HOWEVER there are many who wish to murder their Jewish companions purely because they are Jewish infidels!
Nothing to do with territory, occupation, apartheid. Doesn't matter if the govt includes Ben Gvir or Yitzchak Rabin. If the govt is hawkish or doveish. If land is given to the Arabs or taken from them.
This is an ideological war with an enemy who hates us more than they love their own children "
Maybe then the Gentiles will wake up and realise the monster we have to deal with - and be more sympathetic to when we have to deal with the monster
Spending Pesach in Israel makes me feel the pain more.
We look to our leaders to guide us.
And so, tonight in Bnei Brak, when Rav Asher Weiss gave his famous Chol Hamoed Shiur, he took the opportunity to mention the pain we are feeling about the loss of these two sisters, as well as the loss of two brothers recently as well.
He pretended to be in the center, but the moment he had a chance to gain power he veered left, made a coalition with other leftists, and governed like a leftist during Covid.
Okay, I admit it. I don't understand Israeli politics. The only Israeli Prime Ministers in past 30 years never to have supported a Palestinian State in any form have been Rabin and Bennett. I had thought that opposing a Palestinian State was a characteristic of the Israeli Right. I guess I need to learn more.
I am surprised you didn't mention the antisemitism your descendents would be likely to face, in the future as Jews in non-jewish counties. And large scale persecultion or even extermination like we saw in the holocaust or other pogroms and massacres
There are no words that can adequately describe the horror of the murder of the two girls.
Rabbi Slifkin, you describe the awful realities of our situation in Israel; but you don't present a solution. I didn't really expect to see one as I don't know if there really is a solution. Israel screwed up several times in our history, namely in 1948 and in 1967. We should never have allowed Arab refugee camps to exist in the first place. Historically, populations have moved as a result of wars and border changes. As an example, somewhere between 14 and 18 MILLION people were resettled due to the partition of India and Pakistan. Country after country has done this (see the subject "Popularion_transfer" in Wikipedia)... except for Israel. But, unfortunately, it appears to be too late now. So we're stuck with this horrible reality.
One thing I am certain of is this: only from a position of strength will we have any chance to survive (al pi tevah, at least). Peace (or should we say 'quiet') comes from strength. We must have a strong, pro-active, pro-Jewish government for there to be any semblence of peace. Capitulation and kum-ba-yah peace talks show the Arabs that we are weak and can be overcome and destroyed. That, unfortunately, is the real reality.
"We should never have allowed Arab refugee camps to exist in the first place."
Allowed??? Just what was the new State of Israel supposed to do? Welcome back 700,000 Arabs into the new State when there were only 600,000 Jews there? Israel had no ability to control anything outside of the Armistice Lines.
"somewhere between 14 and 18 MILLION people were resettled due to the partition of India and Pakistan."
And millions died during those forced expulsions. Not a model you want to emulate. Population transfer was banned under international law shortly after that horrible experience, partly as the result of the Nazi population transfers.
"show the Arabs that we are weak and can be overcome and destroyed"
Israel has borders with four Arab states. With two, Egypt and Jordan, it has peace treaties. The other two, Syria and Lebanon, are failed states that are so weak that they can't make peace now or for the forseeable future. Gaza would be a failed state if it were actually a state under Hamas, and the Palestinian National Authority isn't in much better shape. It isn't Israel that is weak.
We should have lobbied harder to not allow Arab refugee camps to exist in the first place
The arabs were in a weak position in '48 Israel could have conditioned its acceptance of the armistice treaty on Arabs absorbing its refugees as did Israel
The Armistices weren't treaties. They were basically cease fires. Israel is still in a state of hot war with Iraq, which never signed an Armistice. And Israel is still in a state of war with Syria and Lebanon.
Furthermore you don't seem to realize how precarious Israel's situation was. No country in the world other than newly Communist Czechoslovakia had given it any arms. The Haganah had not been successful against the Jordanian Arab Legion and a continuation of the war might have resulted in the British-led army and air force getting a total victory. Meanwhile, as British officers were leading the Jordanian army, the US was prosecuting Americans who were running guns to Israel. The Arabs were in anything but a weak position and the very survival of Medinat Yisrael is a miracle as great as that of Chanukah.
Syria and Lebanon, are failed states that are so weak that they can't make peace now.
...
The reason they cannot make peace is that their hatred of Israel overcomes their desire to get out of their weakness. If they were weaker still there may be some hope
You have just shown that you don't understand either country. The only thing that the warring factions in Lebanon agree on is that they all passionately hate Israel. And that is in large part due to the incredibly stupid policies that Israel has had towards that country. And Syria hasn't recovered from its civil war, where the only significant forces allied with western democracy -- the Kurds and the Free Syrian Army -- were thrown under the bus by Donald Trump. (Why Israelis like that rasha is beyond me.)
I'm not talking about the Arab countries surrounding Israel (well, we must learn to ignore some of their dumb demands of us). I'm talking about the Arabs who live in the merkaz and south, the ones that call themselves Palestinians. You show weakness to them and that simply provokes them more and more.
The Arabs in the north (where I live) are Israelis. Yes, there are occasional problems but those are mostly hoodlum or criminal related, not nationalistic. These Arabs are doctors (2 of mine), policemen, and hold every other kind of job you might think of.
"many of these Arabs are descendants of the hundreds of thousands of Arabs who lived here in the 19th century, when there were only a few thousand Jews here"
Substitute "16th century" for "19th century" and you still have a true statement. The late Prof. Bernard Lewis actually looked at the Ottoman census data. I don't think that the Mamluk census records have survived but there wasn't a large Jewish community in that period either -- the Crusaders seem to have almost exterminated us.
At JCPA, Pinhas Inbari has a fascinating study of the origins of Palestinians.
One of his points is summarized:
Not a single Palestinian tribe identifies its roots in Canaan; instead, they all see themselves as proud Arabs descended from the most notable Arab tribes of the Hejaz, today’s Iraq, or Yemen. Even the Kanaan family of Nablus locates its origins in Syria. Some Palestinian clans are Kurdish or Egyptian in origin, and in Mount Hebron, there are traditions of Jewish origins.
Palestinian Arab families are big into geneology and trace their lineage back hundreds of years in the region. Cousin marriage is very common. And the population growth of the Arab population in the region is entirely consistent with natural growth rates.
And there has been no Arab colonialism for almost a millenium. The last Arab rulers -- the Fatimids -- were defeated by the Crusaders in 1099. Under the Umayyad and Abbasid Caliphates, and also under the (non-Arab ruled) Mamluk and Ottoman Empires, there was migration within those states, but to say that that makes the fourth generation descendents of those migrants illegitimate is like saying that my living in New York City is illegitimate because I was born in Philadelphia or because I have no ancestors who were in America prior to 1610. There was no distinction between Hejaz, Iraq, Syria, Palestine, or any other region subject to the Ottoman rule. (Ottoman rule in Yemen was off and on, mostly off.)
Worth mentioning also is that according to Ottoman census records; there were very very few Christians in the Land of Israel in the 16th century. The Christians in places like Ramallah and Bethlehem are the descendants of later arrivals.
The only reason that there are Jews in the Middle East at all was that the Arab Muslims kicked the Byzantine Empire out of the region. The Byzantines had completed a genocide of the Samaritans (who number less than a thousand today) and were preparing to do the same to Jews.
And it was not the Arabs who exterminated the Jews of the Land of Israel, it was the Crusaders.
Clarification- when I say Palestinian society, I mean the ideas that clearly 1. Teach hate 2. Glorify terrorists 3. Actively (and sadly sometimes successfully) try to deny who Jews are and erase our connection to our land.
There is no permanent solution, however the honor/shame mentality needs to be front and center in the minds of the Israeli leaders meaning that we need to stop 1/2 measures when we decide to engage. That when is not for me as an American to decide. There are other actions that need to be taken though imho. The complete dismantle of UNRWRA schools that teach hate. And I don’t understand why Israel’s PR is so bad. The shaking of Palestinians who are terrorists should be front and center. No one cares how good Israel is, the world hates Jews. But as we let media, especially Israeli media demonize it’s own rather than bring how awful Palestinian society is, would be a step forward.
Your words betray you. You are not sending your son, a grown man, to hesder. He is making the choice, perhaps with your encouragement, and is going with your blessing. There is a difference. May Hashem protect him along with all our soldiers.
You're nitpicking with me on his choice of words and how much credit should accrue to him based on his financial contribution? No. He's taking credit for his son's choice, regardless. Is there no low you will stoop to in search of a score? Further, you don't even know the answer to the question and yet still claim it as support for your argument. Stick to what you know.
I have two sons who served in combat units. I didn't "send" them.
I also have a son who told me four years ago he desired to make Torah his occupation, and I do support him financially to some degree to this day. He told his wife to be he would live in a cave if he had to, for the sake of learning Torah. I did not "send" him to engage in what I admire and respect. The only credit I take is raising my children such that they understood it would be a choice I support.
Your comment is premised on nitpicking the word “send”. The point of the piece is that he and his wife chose to live in Israel and live in a DL community where IDF service is the norm for boys despite the increased personal risk. Do parents take pride in their children’s choices? Yes, guilty as charged. That’s a good thing not a bad thing. I also respect you choice to no use the word send with your kids if you feel it inappropriate.
You're not writing a blog that Substack says has thousands of subscribers. More than that, that you feel the need to White Knight for him says much about you. Is he a damsel in distress that you feel the need to defend a poor choice of wording as well as my extremely minor criticism of the same? It's rather pathetic. Silence in this case would have been the better choice.
A waste of his time, but not yours? What are you, his secretary? My words were directed at him, not you. You are literally wasting your time reading or responding. If he doesn't read them, I lose nothing. If you do, and further respond, well, it's just entertainment.
Indeed, it is quite revealing. Concerning his daughter going to the army, only a few months ago NS wrote, " While I am immensely proud of my daughter, her CHOSEN PATH is still jarring for me." (emphasis mine.) He thus consciously absolves himself of the decision making process. Yet for his son, he writes that he "IS SENDING" him to hesder, as though it was NS's decision to take credit for.
Now why this shift in language? Perhaps it is bc NS knows, in his heart, that the very concept of a "female soldier" is contrary to human nature, whereas no parent could be more proud than of a son in the army. Or perhaps it simply reflects more drinking from the liberal fountain, in which no female can ever be questioned, guided, or led, whereas the same is perfectly expected for men. Either way, the words, as you say, betray him.
With all the brilliant minds in Israel, how come it is so difficult to counter the 1950s KGB propaganda that created the concept of the "Palestinian" peoplehood?
Because it doesn't matter. Why? Because many peoplehoods" in the world are rather recent. The Jewish connection to the Land of Israel certainly predates the "Palestinian" connect by centuries. But where is that argument going to work? The Scotts are recent to Scotland, the Hungarians are not indigenous to Hungary, and the Turks invaded Turkey. Israel's Jews preceded the emergence of all these other peoples. Are they going to be sympathetic to the claims of a people whose existence predates their own by centuries?
Your point is valid, but it implicitly negates the nationalism of the peoples you want to convince with your counter-propaganda!
I just wish the United States had as low a homicide rate -- and as low a rate of deaths from terrorism -- as does Israel. And I wish that the United States took every such death as seriously as Israel does. :( :(
Most homicides in the USA is criminals on criminals. Usually gangs hotting other gang members. Not a real loss. The terrorism and the Leftists who enable them is a Holocaust happening.
You win the internet for the most bigoted ignorant insensitive comment of the day. On Yom HaShoah you blame the victims of violent crime. And it is not the Lefists who are promoting the availability of guns to any murderer or terrorist wannabe. Medinat Yisrael knows better than to allow such; you and Americans don't.
Percentage wise Israel has a higher rate of deaths from terrorism
True, but (1) the US is catching up :(, and (2) a death is a death. The US is now at 209 deaths from mass shootings this year and it is only April.
There are no words. My sister said she's been to their house for Shabbat meals. Just a senseless, horrible tragedy. The girls' father told the news that he has been having nightmares while sleeping and wakes up to a reality that was worse than the nightmare. I can't even imagine his pain. I read that and hugged my boys tightly. Hamakom yenachem otam.
Raging about Arabs is pointless. So is pondering solutions devoid of clinging to our traditions. It is not about them. It is about us, collectively. Seems like ancient history today, but the below famous story is more appropriate than ever. Sadly, also very timely. Consider, the next time someone claims a mechallel Shabbos or chometz-eater on Pesach in the army is doing more for the Jews than those loyal to our traditions.
https://www.jewishmediaresources.com/93/why-arafat-wont-compromise
by Jonathan Rosenblum, Jerusalem Post, July 28, 2000
Salah Tamari, a former Palestinian terrorist told Israeli journalist Aharon Barnea of the complete transformation he underwent in an Israeli prison. While in prison, he had completely despaired of any hope that the Palestinians would one day realize any of their territorial dreams, and so he was ready to renounce the struggle.
Then, one Pesach, he witnessed his Jewish warder eating a pita sandwich. Tamari was shocked, and asked his jailer how he could so unashamedly eat bread on Pesach.
The Jew replied: 'I feel no obligation to events that took place over 2,000 years ago. I have no connection to that.'
That entire night Tamari could not sleep. He thought to himself: 'A nation whose members have no connection to their past, and are capable of so openly transgressing their most important laws - that nation has cut off all its roots to the Land.'
He concluded that the Palestinians could, in fact, achieve all their goals. From that moment, he determined 'to fight for everything - not a percentage, not such crumbs as the Israelis might throw us - but for everything. Because opposing us is a nation that has no connection to its roots, which are no longer of interest to it.'
Tamari goes on to relate how he shared this insight with 'tens of thousands of his colleagues, and all were convinced.'
THE severance of connection to a Jewish past is one of the chief goals of the branja (clique), which, as alarmingly described by Yoram Hazony in his book, The Jewish State: The Struggle for Israel's Soul, dominates Israeli intellectual life, and whose influence is felt in every sphere - education, the military, and the judiciary.
But that article was from nearly 25 years ago, describing an event many years before that. Israel has grown more religious and right wing since then. Many more Jews now DO feel the connection to the past.
Of course, us religious Jews have a different problem from the left, and that's this sense of fatalism, that God is in control so it doesn't really matter what we do anyway. This has always been our Achilles Heel, and the reason why it was the left, and not the right, who built Israel and laid the foundation for so many other Jewish institutions.
So. It more applicable today. The problems are worse. It's not just about non-observant Jews munching on chometz when they shouldn't. Even "connected" Jews reject our roots. This blog's continued existence is a testament to this fact.
Shaarei Teshuva, Gate 3:160 (translation by Feldheim): "The aspect of "haters of Hashem" can also be found at times among those who perform mitzvos and are scrupulous in avoiding sin, both in deed and in speech -- if they are pained and inwardly troubled when their friends engage in Torah study, and it bothers them when others serve Hashem and fear Him."
Agreed that even religious people don't always feel their roots, but I dont agree that it has relevance here. Jews in Israel are much, MUCH more connected to tradition than they were in the 1970s or 80s when the (individual) story described in the article took place.
No relevance here? Natan says a mechallel Shabbos (or, equivalently, a chometz eater on Pesach) in the army does more for Klal Yisrael than the Shomer Shabbos avrech in kollel. This is a stance that applies for all time, not just now. He would have said the same about the pita eater decades ago. Yet, that pita eater inspired all the Arab activity to this very day. That is relevant. The only way to undo that is to embrace the entirety of our heritage.
I pray Natan has his own sleepless night followed by a similarly powerful transformation, and choose to cease being counted among the Haters of Hashem.
I meant the story was "not relevant" only in the sense that Israelis as a whole are now more in touch with their roots, and so the story with the prison guard is no longer representative.
Good Yom Tov.
True. Kosher restaurants were a rarity in Tel Aviv a mere 20 years ago. Now, they are commonplace.
Also, it may be a story of one man, but it is not an individual story. By his own words, he influenced thousands to harden their hearts and take their war to the next level, and everything that has occurred since is due to that one incident.
Meanwhile, limud Torah, "kneged kulam," is an embarrassment at best to people like Natan. He is no different from a m'challel Shabbos in their impact. Even more so as a public figure who spouts odious opinions.
RNS does not practise what he preaches - he is sending (incidentally, what does that mean? Isn't his son old enough to make his own decisions?) his son to a hesder yeshiva!! So instead of serving the full 3 years his son will only be serving less than 18 months, in order to learn in yeshiva. Doesn't he think it unfair that he will not be "sharing the burden equally" with his non religious brothers? After all, according to RNS, the only justification for full time Torah study is in order to teach, and hesder yeshiva graduates don't usually become rabbinic teachers when they complete their truncated military service.....
Horrific. השם ינקם דמם.
It is events like these that highlight the advantage of the mystical approach. I for one believe that such tragedies have deeper meaning and Hashem has a plan for all of us. מי שמאמין לא מפחד.
In contrast, the rationalist approach looks like tragedies like this as mere coincidence or happenstance. And that loss of meaning is in itself an additional tragedy.
@Ash
What plan is that? Is it the same one that gave us churban bayit rishon, churban bayit shayni, multiple holy inquisitions, the holocaust, to mention just a few of Hashem’s monstrous exterminations. Yeah, there must be a deeper meaning. Let me know what it is when his next carnage smacks you in the face.
If I were you, I’d put my trust in someone other than an entity that kills you every time he feels that he’s been disrespected.
Yeah, that one. The one that also gave me my life, my wife, my beautiful kids, my Parnassus, my anything and everything, and ultimate reward both in this world and the next.
and what is that deeper meaning?
I haven't the faintest. Only Hashem knows. I merely trust him.
And that loss of meaning ....
what meaning is lost? trust is mot a meaning.
Stories like these are so heartbreaking and frustrating I prefer to switch of Israeli news
On a side point, I may be a British Jew who has to put up with the stream of anti Israeli sentiment in the UK press from even so called neutral papers but to me the Isralei hasbara/PR is woeful
Every time one of these attacks happens the UK press refer to settlements, occupation, apartheid, Al Aksa provocations, etc as if they are to be expected or even tolerated!
Even the BBC stoop to such depths, for example referring to the Paley murders in Ramot being a "settlement in East Jerusalem" (absolute lies)!
About time we called a spade and spade and reiterated one message and one message only:
"There are many Palestinian Muslims who would like to leave in peace alongside their Jewish companions. HOWEVER there are many who wish to murder their Jewish companions purely because they are Jewish infidels!
Nothing to do with territory, occupation, apartheid. Doesn't matter if the govt includes Ben Gvir or Yitzchak Rabin. If the govt is hawkish or doveish. If land is given to the Arabs or taken from them.
This is an ideological war with an enemy who hates us more than they love their own children "
Maybe then the Gentiles will wake up and realise the monster we have to deal with - and be more sympathetic to when we have to deal with the monster
Spending Pesach in Israel makes me feel the pain more.
We look to our leaders to guide us.
And so, tonight in Bnei Brak, when Rav Asher Weiss gave his famous Chol Hamoed Shiur, he took the opportunity to mention the pain we are feeling about the loss of these two sisters, as well as the loss of two brothers recently as well.
good article on Israel winning the conflict
https://www.danielpipes.org/21639/how-can-israel-win-the-palestinian-conflict
How Can Israel Win the Palestinian Conflict?
Historian Explains
"Generosity towards enemies runs counter to history and to common sense."
Generosity towards defeated enemies is the only way to prevent them from becoming perpetual enemies.
Generosity towards undefeated enemies which Israel does, invited more terror. See Gaza withdrawal.
There should never have been settlements in Gaza in the first place.
"A democratic government may not defeat its own population. "
Wrong. See United States, 1861 to 1865.
" Jeremy Corbyn, Bernie Sanders"
No fan of Bernie Sanders here, but he absolutely does not deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence as Jeremy Corbyn.
Agreed. Corbyn is far far worse.
Naftali Bennett was Center Left????
He pretended to be in the center, but the moment he had a chance to gain power he veered left, made a coalition with other leftists, and governed like a leftist during Covid.
Okay, I admit it. I don't understand Israeli politics. The only Israeli Prime Ministers in past 30 years never to have supported a Palestinian State in any form have been Rabin and Bennett. I had thought that opposing a Palestinian State was a characteristic of the Israeli Right. I guess I need to learn more.
What Bennett COVID policy was "leftist"?
I am surprised you didn't mention the antisemitism your descendents would be likely to face, in the future as Jews in non-jewish counties. And large scale persecultion or even extermination like we saw in the holocaust or other pogroms and massacres
There are no words that can adequately describe the horror of the murder of the two girls.
Rabbi Slifkin, you describe the awful realities of our situation in Israel; but you don't present a solution. I didn't really expect to see one as I don't know if there really is a solution. Israel screwed up several times in our history, namely in 1948 and in 1967. We should never have allowed Arab refugee camps to exist in the first place. Historically, populations have moved as a result of wars and border changes. As an example, somewhere between 14 and 18 MILLION people were resettled due to the partition of India and Pakistan. Country after country has done this (see the subject "Popularion_transfer" in Wikipedia)... except for Israel. But, unfortunately, it appears to be too late now. So we're stuck with this horrible reality.
One thing I am certain of is this: only from a position of strength will we have any chance to survive (al pi tevah, at least). Peace (or should we say 'quiet') comes from strength. We must have a strong, pro-active, pro-Jewish government for there to be any semblence of peace. Capitulation and kum-ba-yah peace talks show the Arabs that we are weak and can be overcome and destroyed. That, unfortunately, is the real reality.
"We should never have allowed Arab refugee camps to exist in the first place."
Allowed??? Just what was the new State of Israel supposed to do? Welcome back 700,000 Arabs into the new State when there were only 600,000 Jews there? Israel had no ability to control anything outside of the Armistice Lines.
"somewhere between 14 and 18 MILLION people were resettled due to the partition of India and Pakistan."
And millions died during those forced expulsions. Not a model you want to emulate. Population transfer was banned under international law shortly after that horrible experience, partly as the result of the Nazi population transfers.
"show the Arabs that we are weak and can be overcome and destroyed"
Israel has borders with four Arab states. With two, Egypt and Jordan, it has peace treaties. The other two, Syria and Lebanon, are failed states that are so weak that they can't make peace now or for the forseeable future. Gaza would be a failed state if it were actually a state under Hamas, and the Palestinian National Authority isn't in much better shape. It isn't Israel that is weak.
Not a model you want to emulate.
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In retrospect, If Israel had expelled all of them, Thousands of innocent Jewish lives would have been saved, which makes it perfectly justified.
We should have lobbied harder to not allow Arab refugee camps to exist in the first place
The arabs were in a weak position in '48 Israel could have conditioned its acceptance of the armistice treaty on Arabs absorbing its refugees as did Israel
Lobbied harder? Really? With whom?
The Armistices weren't treaties. They were basically cease fires. Israel is still in a state of hot war with Iraq, which never signed an Armistice. And Israel is still in a state of war with Syria and Lebanon.
Furthermore you don't seem to realize how precarious Israel's situation was. No country in the world other than newly Communist Czechoslovakia had given it any arms. The Haganah had not been successful against the Jordanian Arab Legion and a continuation of the war might have resulted in the British-led army and air force getting a total victory. Meanwhile, as British officers were leading the Jordanian army, the US was prosecuting Americans who were running guns to Israel. The Arabs were in anything but a weak position and the very survival of Medinat Yisrael is a miracle as great as that of Chanukah.
Syria and Lebanon, are failed states that are so weak that they can't make peace now.
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The reason they cannot make peace is that their hatred of Israel overcomes their desire to get out of their weakness. If they were weaker still there may be some hope
You have just shown that you don't understand either country. The only thing that the warring factions in Lebanon agree on is that they all passionately hate Israel. And that is in large part due to the incredibly stupid policies that Israel has had towards that country. And Syria hasn't recovered from its civil war, where the only significant forces allied with western democracy -- the Kurds and the Free Syrian Army -- were thrown under the bus by Donald Trump. (Why Israelis like that rasha is beyond me.)
I'm not talking about the Arab countries surrounding Israel (well, we must learn to ignore some of their dumb demands of us). I'm talking about the Arabs who live in the merkaz and south, the ones that call themselves Palestinians. You show weakness to them and that simply provokes them more and more.
The Arabs in the north (where I live) are Israelis. Yes, there are occasional problems but those are mostly hoodlum or criminal related, not nationalistic. These Arabs are doctors (2 of mine), policemen, and hold every other kind of job you might think of.
"many of these Arabs are descendants of the hundreds of thousands of Arabs who lived here in the 19th century, when there were only a few thousand Jews here"
Substitute "16th century" for "19th century" and you still have a true statement. The late Prof. Bernard Lewis actually looked at the Ottoman census data. I don't think that the Mamluk census records have survived but there wasn't a large Jewish community in that period either -- the Crusaders seem to have almost exterminated us.
Only a small percentage of arabs are descended from 18th century arabs. Not saying jews are higher but that is is partly because of arab colonialism
https://elderofziyon.blogspot.com/2017/08/the-only-indigenous-palestinian-arab.html
At JCPA, Pinhas Inbari has a fascinating study of the origins of Palestinians.
One of his points is summarized:
Not a single Palestinian tribe identifies its roots in Canaan; instead, they all see themselves as proud Arabs descended from the most notable Arab tribes of the Hejaz, today’s Iraq, or Yemen. Even the Kanaan family of Nablus locates its origins in Syria. Some Palestinian clans are Kurdish or Egyptian in origin, and in Mount Hebron, there are traditions of Jewish origins.
Palestinian Arab families are big into geneology and trace their lineage back hundreds of years in the region. Cousin marriage is very common. And the population growth of the Arab population in the region is entirely consistent with natural growth rates.
And there has been no Arab colonialism for almost a millenium. The last Arab rulers -- the Fatimids -- were defeated by the Crusaders in 1099. Under the Umayyad and Abbasid Caliphates, and also under the (non-Arab ruled) Mamluk and Ottoman Empires, there was migration within those states, but to say that that makes the fourth generation descendents of those migrants illegitimate is like saying that my living in New York City is illegitimate because I was born in Philadelphia or because I have no ancestors who were in America prior to 1610. There was no distinction between Hejaz, Iraq, Syria, Palestine, or any other region subject to the Ottoman rule. (Ottoman rule in Yemen was off and on, mostly off.)
Worth mentioning also is that according to Ottoman census records; there were very very few Christians in the Land of Israel in the 16th century. The Christians in places like Ramallah and Bethlehem are the descendants of later arrivals.
Arab 7th century colonialism is part of the reason why only a minority of Jews can trace their ancestry to 18th century
Spectacularly wrong.
The only reason that there are Jews in the Middle East at all was that the Arab Muslims kicked the Byzantine Empire out of the region. The Byzantines had completed a genocide of the Samaritans (who number less than a thousand today) and were preparing to do the same to Jews.
And it was not the Arabs who exterminated the Jews of the Land of Israel, it was the Crusaders.
המקום ינחם אתכם
ה׳ יקום דמם
* shaming not shaking!
Clarification- when I say Palestinian society, I mean the ideas that clearly 1. Teach hate 2. Glorify terrorists 3. Actively (and sadly sometimes successfully) try to deny who Jews are and erase our connection to our land.
There is no permanent solution, however the honor/shame mentality needs to be front and center in the minds of the Israeli leaders meaning that we need to stop 1/2 measures when we decide to engage. That when is not for me as an American to decide. There are other actions that need to be taken though imho. The complete dismantle of UNRWRA schools that teach hate. And I don’t understand why Israel’s PR is so bad. The shaking of Palestinians who are terrorists should be front and center. No one cares how good Israel is, the world hates Jews. But as we let media, especially Israeli media demonize it’s own rather than bring how awful Palestinian society is, would be a step forward.
Your words betray you. You are not sending your son, a grown man, to hesder. He is making the choice, perhaps with your encouragement, and is going with your blessing. There is a difference. May Hashem protect him along with all our soldiers.
Is Hesder Yeshiva free in Israel? I sent my kids to college and Yeshiva despite them choosing their destinations.
You're nitpicking with me on his choice of words and how much credit should accrue to him based on his financial contribution? No. He's taking credit for his son's choice, regardless. Is there no low you will stoop to in search of a score? Further, you don't even know the answer to the question and yet still claim it as support for your argument. Stick to what you know.
I have two sons who served in combat units. I didn't "send" them.
I also have a son who told me four years ago he desired to make Torah his occupation, and I do support him financially to some degree to this day. He told his wife to be he would live in a cave if he had to, for the sake of learning Torah. I did not "send" him to engage in what I admire and respect. The only credit I take is raising my children such that they understood it would be a choice I support.
Your comment is premised on nitpicking the word “send”. The point of the piece is that he and his wife chose to live in Israel and live in a DL community where IDF service is the norm for boys despite the increased personal risk. Do parents take pride in their children’s choices? Yes, guilty as charged. That’s a good thing not a bad thing. I also respect you choice to no use the word send with your kids if you feel it inappropriate.
You're not writing a blog that Substack says has thousands of subscribers. More than that, that you feel the need to White Knight for him says much about you. Is he a damsel in distress that you feel the need to defend a poor choice of wording as well as my extremely minor criticism of the same? It's rather pathetic. Silence in this case would have been the better choice.
Yes I think it would be a waste of his valuable time to respond to comment threads reading the entrails of his word choices.
A waste of his time, but not yours? What are you, his secretary? My words were directed at him, not you. You are literally wasting your time reading or responding. If he doesn't read them, I lose nothing. If you do, and further respond, well, it's just entertainment.
Indeed, it is quite revealing. Concerning his daughter going to the army, only a few months ago NS wrote, " While I am immensely proud of my daughter, her CHOSEN PATH is still jarring for me." (emphasis mine.) He thus consciously absolves himself of the decision making process. Yet for his son, he writes that he "IS SENDING" him to hesder, as though it was NS's decision to take credit for.
Now why this shift in language? Perhaps it is bc NS knows, in his heart, that the very concept of a "female soldier" is contrary to human nature, whereas no parent could be more proud than of a son in the army. Or perhaps it simply reflects more drinking from the liberal fountain, in which no female can ever be questioned, guided, or led, whereas the same is perfectly expected for men. Either way, the words, as you say, betray him.
With all the brilliant minds in Israel, how come it is so difficult to counter the 1950s KGB propaganda that created the concept of the "Palestinian" peoplehood?
Because it doesn't matter. Why? Because many peoplehoods" in the world are rather recent. The Jewish connection to the Land of Israel certainly predates the "Palestinian" connect by centuries. But where is that argument going to work? The Scotts are recent to Scotland, the Hungarians are not indigenous to Hungary, and the Turks invaded Turkey. Israel's Jews preceded the emergence of all these other peoples. Are they going to be sympathetic to the claims of a people whose existence predates their own by centuries?
Your point is valid, but it implicitly negates the nationalism of the peoples you want to convince with your counter-propaganda!
We need to convince ourselves. As long as we have Jews who hate Haredim more than they fear terrorists, we have no chance.