When I read what Yitzchak Yosef said about Rav Granot yesterday I literally cried. I'm still crying. Rav Granot is a Talmud Chacham steeped in moral values and unfortunately now steeped in loss. How a person who was once Chief Rabbi can say the things he did strips him of any right to claim any respect for any bit of Torah he may have learned. He is not a rav, he is a pathetic, sorry excuse for a man. Maybe that's who he has been all along.
I read the letters published to the Charedi public that you posted. For your average uneducated Charedi man or family, they are very sharply worded and very intimidating. I will acknowledge that unless we start publishing letters and "pashkevilim" to counter theirs, this is their version of X and this is what they are reading and absorbing. We are fighting a losing battle, against a massive public that considers anyone not Charedi a sworn enemy. Indoctrinating their children with the mindset that anyone besides them is a secular "rasha" is a goal- I know because I come from that world. When you plop baseball caps on kids heads and tell them they are soldiers in a Holy War supporting "hostages", they believe it.
I don't know where this goes.
I feel a lot of despair.
I saw a good comment by Hillel Fuld that is applicable here. When the media posts pictures of "starving children" in Gaza, Israel responds by talking about drip irrigation and cherry tomatoes. That PR doesn't work. Similarly here, the Dati Leumi and other communities need to start rising up as a force. We need to advocate better for ourselves- to make it crystal clear that we are not a welfare state supporting a people who think this is Lithuania or Lakewood. We deserve better. We have given up so many precious lives-including Amitai Granot A'H- that I think we have earned the right to begin speaking and acting a lot more forcefully.
I read the article in Times of Israel that @ChanaRachel referenced. The article included much discussion about arresting those who have ignored their army callups. From a practical point of view, I don't see arrests and incarnation as a viable solution or response to the refusal for enlisting.
I believe a more realistic solution to the overall problem is to simply deny *any* government funding to such families. Further, disallow them the ability to vote on any government position. In addition, I would suggest that all funding to haredi yeshivas should be redirected to the yeshivas that have had talmidim that fell in battle.
I thought about going to some counter-demonstration on Thursday (assuming there is one) but I'm not sure there's any real point to that.
"This has justly earned the disgust of most of the Israeli population"
If that were true, there would at least be hope for change after the next election, but see below. Two Likud minsters/MKs think the demonstration is a great idea.
“It could definitely be a good idea to come, and even if I don’t, my heart is with all the House of Israel who want to stop the persecution,” Communications Minister Shlomo Karhi told Radio Kol Hai on Monday morning.
Likud MK Avichai Boaron sounded a similar note, telling Radio Kol Barama that he was “thinking of joining this rally.”
Re your comment above ascribed to “Rav” Sholom Ber Sorotzkin that said
"He explained that the hostage logo and slogan “belongs” to the charedim, since charedim are the ones whose Torah was responsible for getting the hostages released."
Surely if the charedim had been learning properly there would not have been any war or massacre ? Since there was then if they have integrity they should beg for mechila ( forgiveness) from the rest of us and especially all the widows, orphans and wounded ?
When I read what Yitzchak Yosef said about Rav Granot yesterday I literally cried. I'm still crying. Rav Granot is a Talmud Chacham steeped in moral values and unfortunately now steeped in loss. How a person who was once Chief Rabbi can say the things he did strips him of any right to claim any respect for any bit of Torah he may have learned. He is not a rav, he is a pathetic, sorry excuse for a man. Maybe that's who he has been all along.
I read the letters published to the Charedi public that you posted. For your average uneducated Charedi man or family, they are very sharply worded and very intimidating. I will acknowledge that unless we start publishing letters and "pashkevilim" to counter theirs, this is their version of X and this is what they are reading and absorbing. We are fighting a losing battle, against a massive public that considers anyone not Charedi a sworn enemy. Indoctrinating their children with the mindset that anyone besides them is a secular "rasha" is a goal- I know because I come from that world. When you plop baseball caps on kids heads and tell them they are soldiers in a Holy War supporting "hostages", they believe it.
I don't know where this goes.
I feel a lot of despair.
I saw a good comment by Hillel Fuld that is applicable here. When the media posts pictures of "starving children" in Gaza, Israel responds by talking about drip irrigation and cherry tomatoes. That PR doesn't work. Similarly here, the Dati Leumi and other communities need to start rising up as a force. We need to advocate better for ourselves- to make it crystal clear that we are not a welfare state supporting a people who think this is Lithuania or Lakewood. We deserve better. We have given up so many precious lives-including Amitai Granot A'H- that I think we have earned the right to begin speaking and acting a lot more forcefully.
I read the article in Times of Israel that @ChanaRachel referenced. The article included much discussion about arresting those who have ignored their army callups. From a practical point of view, I don't see arrests and incarnation as a viable solution or response to the refusal for enlisting.
I believe a more realistic solution to the overall problem is to simply deny *any* government funding to such families. Further, disallow them the ability to vote on any government position. In addition, I would suggest that all funding to haredi yeshivas should be redirected to the yeshivas that have had talmidim that fell in battle.
I thought about going to some counter-demonstration on Thursday (assuming there is one) but I'm not sure there's any real point to that.
The idea of martyrdom is big with Chareidim as long as ot stays theoretical.
"This has justly earned the disgust of most of the Israeli population"
If that were true, there would at least be hope for change after the next election, but see below. Two Likud minsters/MKs think the demonstration is a great idea.
“It could definitely be a good idea to come, and even if I don’t, my heart is with all the House of Israel who want to stop the persecution,” Communications Minister Shlomo Karhi told Radio Kol Hai on Monday morning.
Likud MK Avichai Boaron sounded a similar note, telling Radio Kol Barama that he was “thinking of joining this rally.”
https://www.timesofisrael.com/ultra-orthodox-plan-massive-anti-draft-rally-at-entrance-to-jerusalem-on-thursday/
Yes, my next post is about Likud prostitution. It will cost them at the ballot box.
Re your comment above ascribed to “Rav” Sholom Ber Sorotzkin that said
"He explained that the hostage logo and slogan “belongs” to the charedim, since charedim are the ones whose Torah was responsible for getting the hostages released."
Surely if the charedim had been learning properly there would not have been any war or massacre ? Since there was then if they have integrity they should beg for mechila ( forgiveness) from the rest of us and especially all the widows, orphans and wounded ?