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Sep 26, 2023·edited Sep 26, 2023

You've got it all wrong.

The sentiment Rav Elyashiv expressed is still shared by most mainstream chareidim even today. They refrain from speaking about it in public forums such as the papers precisely because it can be misconstrued in the way you seem to be doing.

Most chareidim recognize that the miracles of the 6 day war are reasons to be happy and thank god for, but there are 2 issues that make it impossible to celebrate openly in the way you would like:

1. Unfortunately the way theses events are celebrated and recounted by the majority of Israeli's (and the way it is celebrated by the state and its institutions) is a story of the mighty IDF defeating our enemies, a story of the greatness of the Zionist enterprise etc. A typical story: one Israeli general was asked shortly after the 6 day war if he looks up to the heavens before he goes to war. his answer - no. I only look to the left and the right to see how many tanks I have. Can there be any bigger blaspheme? But this is a sentiment shared by a vast amount of Israelis and most of its elite class. Anyone with a shred of religious sensitivity cannot help but be disgusted by this. This makes it very difficult to celebrate in Israel the events of the 6 day war without being misconstrued as joining and supporting the way its celebrated . It would also cause much confusion amongst the simple masses of charedim who are unable to understand the complexity of our position.

2. Most dati leumi view the events of yom haatzmaut and yom yerushalayim as basically getting us most of the way there to the geula sheleima. Look - the country has been rebuilt, the economy is booming, look at the high-tech center, look at our powerful army, etc. etc.. Most charedim on the other hand view it very differently. While these things are positive developments, they are very very far from the geulah sheleima. We still have no Beis hamikdash, no Malchus, no Avodah, no Sanhedrin, no Kohen gadol, no meaningful rabbinic authority. Judaism is a shell of how its meant to look in practice in the holy land. When the messiah comes there will need to be an upheaval of biblical proportions to get us where we need to be. The country is run by a secular government by secular laws with a secular court system. The vast majority of Jews are openly antagonistic towards Judaism or know nothing about it. etc. etc. This is what makes it so hard for the charedim to celebrate jubulantly.

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1. This was a nearly half-century old recollection, from a man then in his mid to high 70s, and a particularly ideological man, at that. As much as I admired R. Gold, this hearsay memory is almost certainly inaccurate or incomplete. (Assuming, of course, that you yourself are reporting it accurately.)

2. People's positions are never as simplistic as their opponents try to characterize them. R. Elyashiv in particular, who everyone knows was a paid employee of the Israeli govt, certainly would have had mixed feelings about the state of Israel, as indeed, any thinking person must have.

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I'm with Rav Elyashiv, as usual.

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Marc Shapiro often points out that the idea of a gadol hador is a misnomer. The chareidi world chooses a "gadol" that matched their hashkafic expectations. If a torah scholar veers from the hashkafic norm, he just won't be accepted. Who decides what the accepted halachic norm is, is not clear. But these norms choose thr gadol and not the gadol deciding on the norm ie Das torah.

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My brother.

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Does anyone know what R' Elyashiv's opinion is on why we wouldn't say Hallel on Yom Yerushalayim? But more importantly, I would like to know where to find his decision on the matter in writing.

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Rav Elyashiv was also proficient in the works of Rav Kook (though I'm sure he didn't agree with everything). But he was willing to keep his sefer on his desk for all to see.

https://jewishaction.com/jewish-world/people/rav-kook-rav-elyashiv/

This all being said, there is a valid distinction between being happy that Yerushalayim being back in Jewish hands and celebrating it together with Zionists (secular or religious).

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I once met Reb Shalom in 1969 at the house of his close friend from Ner Israel, Rav Yisroel Ber Caplan, a totally Chareidi rosh kollel in Jerusalem. I got the impression he was a man who had one foot in the Chareidi Yeshiva world and the other foot in the Religious Zionist/Modern Orthodox world. I don't think that he actually integrated them together in his life.

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End of an era.

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"I never really figured out what he wanted. Should we bring the British back and renew the Mandate? Close Eretz Yisrael to all the world's Jews? Did he want us to hand the Kosel over to Jordan or the Vatican? He was vague (or confused?)."

"You were in America for the nineteen years that we were here unable to pray at the Kosel. You obviously don't appreciate or understand the depth of our feeling for Yerushalayim and the pain of being separated from her."

"It is inconceivable for such a story to be reported in the charedi press in at least the last twenty years, or for them to claim that Yom Yerushalayim is a “Great Day.”"

It's not terribly complicated. The 19 years *started* when the state was founded. Yes, we're deeply grateful that the Israeli military recaptured the kosel in 1967. We just wish it had never been lost in 1948. 'Hakotel be'yadenu' was very thrilling in the immediate aftermath, but as the 2 events recede, it's largely a wash between pre-1948 to post-1967. <Cue the meraglim accusations.>

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This fruit-stand theology is so annoying. https://www.rationalistjudaism.com/p/pure-gold/comment/18294191

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"Rav Gold was molded in Torah VoDaas, Chevron, Ponovezh and suchlike" I thought Chevron is an oil company. What's wrong with "Hevron"? The word starts with a ח, not a כ.

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This is a beautiful story! Thank you for sharing!

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