"They will profess that human agency never counts, and that the terrorist would have died anyway, because that's the way Divine Providence works,"
If the Chareidim were consistent they would say the same thing of the victims of the attack itself, that nothing really matters, "everything is Min HaShamayim" and they all were destined to be victims anyway. But nobody, not even the Chareidim, says or truly believes that, and there's little basis for it. See the Ohr HaChaim to Breishis, 37;21.
Yep. It's the usual "heads I win, tails you lose": anything good (in their eyes) is God, anything neutral/bad is free will/punishment. Anything can be reinterpreted to fit
The reason charedim won't allow their sons to join the IDF is because they don't want their sons to lose their high level of religion. Financial repercussions won't change this. If the IDF is given over to the charedim and becomes totally charedi, the charedim will all join, and they won't let anyone else join.
So either way the leftist plan that the IDF should be a כור היתוך will never come to fruition.
Could be. But more important to them is to avoid injury or death, chas veshalom. Also they don't need a bigger Shidduch crisis, chareidi boys dying and being injured,chas veshalom.
Why would you make an assumption like that without any evidence? Are you projecting? Has any charedi person or rabbi every said such a thing? Why not listen to what they are actually saying - that they won't join the IDF because they don't want to lose their standard of religion, and they are convinced that by joining the IDF they will lose it.
Look, if you hate charedim and just want to malign them, I get that. But if you want to have an intelligent discussion about the topic, let's stick to their actual claims and discuss them.
"They will profess that human agency never counts, and that the terrorist would have died anyway, because that's the way Divine Providence works,"
If the Chareidim were consistent they would say the same thing of the victims of the attack itself, that nothing really matters, "everything is Min HaShamayim" and they all were destined to be victims anyway. But nobody, not even the Chareidim, says or truly believes that, and there's little basis for it. See the Ohr HaChaim to Breishis, 37;21.
Yep. It's the usual "heads I win, tails you lose": anything good (in their eyes) is God, anything neutral/bad is free will/punishment. Anything can be reinterpreted to fit
So when terrorists murder non charedi Jews, it's a punishment. But when terrorists murder chareidi Jews it's Divine Will?
Ok, sure. That totally makes sense. /s
Personal experience with friends tells me that it really does matter that the heroes were also Haredi.
The reason charedim won't allow their sons to join the IDF is because they don't want their sons to lose their high level of religion. Financial repercussions won't change this. If the IDF is given over to the charedim and becomes totally charedi, the charedim will all join, and they won't let anyone else join.
So either way the leftist plan that the IDF should be a כור היתוך will never come to fruition.
Could be. But more important to them is to avoid injury or death, chas veshalom. Also they don't need a bigger Shidduch crisis, chareidi boys dying and being injured,chas veshalom.
Why would you make an assumption like that without any evidence? Are you projecting? Has any charedi person or rabbi every said such a thing? Why not listen to what they are actually saying - that they won't join the IDF because they don't want to lose their standard of religion, and they are convinced that by joining the IDF they will lose it.
Look, if you hate charedim and just want to malign them, I get that. But if you want to have an intelligent discussion about the topic, let's stick to their actual claims and discuss them.