Monday, January 18, 2021

Mazeltov! Murder Tonight.

Over the months since the lethal pandemic started, it's been studied intensively. There's still a lot that we don't know, or which is disputed. And the laws and regulations don't always reflect the scientific reality. (Not to mention that it's difficult to respect them when they are selectively enforced, or when important political figures flout them.)

But one thing has been well established: the major factor in transmission is airflow. Airflow itself in turn depends on various factors. The biggest factor by far is whether one is indoors or outdoors. Another factor is what people are doing; when people speak or sing loudly, they produce dramatically larger numbers of micron-sized particles compared to when they use a normal voice - even more than during coughing. 

So, going to the beach involves very little risk. At the other end of the spectrum, having masses of people crowded into a building, singing at the tops of their voices, is not just illegal; it's about the most dangerous thing you can do.

And that's exactly what Bobov is doing tonight.

It's the wedding of the Rebbe's youngest son. Mazeltov! A tremendous simcha for the chassidim of Bobov. And so they've been gathering from all over the world for this momentous occasion. 

As the original report details, arranging this wedding has presented an enormous logistical challenge. After all, there is a lethal global pandemic, and in the US it's illegal to hold such an event. But, nothing less than the best will do for such a momentous occasion! So, they spent a lot of effort finding a venue where they can crowd all the thousands of guests, without the authorities finding out. The location is being guarded as a tight secret until just before the wedding. And all the chassidim have been warned "a thousand times" not to take any photos during the event, so as not to get Bobov in trouble.

An article posted online this morning spelled all this out in great detail. Since I first put this post out a few hours ago, it's been changed. It now claims that the wedding will be very small and all the thousands of chassidim will be celebrating at home! But the original is available in a cached version, and I took a screenshot to display here. 

Now, it is true that every society takes risks for things that it deems extremely important. Global society allows car travel at speeds over thirty miles per hour. Religious Zionist society encourages people to live in somewhat dangerous places. And the wedding of the Rebbe's youngest son is extremely important to Bobov.

On the other hand, this is not a tiny risk. Such an event will certainly result in mass Covid-19 transmission and very likely in death. Furthermore, by gathering chassidim from all over the world, it's going to spread all the different strains of Covid. (Bear in mindtoo that this is not a bunch of disconnected people making personal decisions - this is a centrally-planned event, approved by the Rebbe himself.) And if you've created a society where mass transmission of a deadly virus and the near-certain loss of life, not to mention breaking the law in a major way and causing immense chillul Hashem and damage to all religious Jewry, is all justified by celebrating a wedding, then, well, maybe your society has its priorities all wrong.

Of course, the usual readers of this website are not going to be attending the wedding. But they already changed the news report as a result of my post going out, so maybe they will realize that the cat is out of the bag and they need to cancel it. And maybe we should think about this event when we support various sects of Chassidus.


(If you'd like to subscribe to this blog via email, use the form on the right of the page, or send me an email and I will add you.) 

80 comments:

  1. This is not fundamentally different from some of the events hosted recently by the (soon to be former) President, it seems like planning life threatening events is a popular form of population control in some societies.

    I hope that they at least set up a fund to cover the funeral costs and to provide for the widows and orphans which will result from this wedding.

    Mazal Tov, and may they be comforted among the mourners of Zion and Jerusalem.

    ReplyDelete
  2. The link has total different story it speaks about a toned-down minimal wedding. Like ancients anti-semites you take a story out of context to blame in this incident the chassidim. This all despite the fact that the per capita death rate in boropark is lower than most of New York City. However you chose to ignore all secular illegal gatherings but zoom in on religion shame on you anti-semite.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Wow. They changed the entire article. I will post the original.

      Delete
    2. Anonymous, how about an apology?

      Delete
    3. Here on Israel haredim have a much higher death rate . 1 in 135 haredim over 65 had died of covid cf 1 in 435 national religios/secular. At one stage 78% of the intensive care beds in the hospital i work at were occupied by Haredim . It seems that meeting on the beach is less dangerous than meeting in shule

      Delete
  3. I have no dog in this fight, but the article says the exact opposite of what you claim it says. It might be they are hinting and winking, but what it says is that the wedding will be limited and thousands of chassidim will be celebrating at home.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Wow. They changed the entire article. I will post the original.

      Delete
  4. As a limud zechus I would say most of them probably think they got it already. Everybody I spoke to in NY and Lakewood were absolutely convinced they got it in like, April. Not that they are correct.

    Also, if you would know how important a Rebbeish wedding is to Chasidic society, you wouldn't write this. To them, it's much more important than the US Constitution is to Americans. The same Constitution that prevents us from taking extreme lockdown measures, like China, that clearly would have saved hundreds of thousands of lives.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It's simply not the case that every bobover chassid has had it, but every bobover chassid will feel pressure to attend.

      Delete
    2. i hope that limud zchus will be of comfort to those outsiders who pay the price for that priority.
      kt

      Delete
    3. @happy, the Charedi-culture apologist are just unfalsifiable by any measure.

      If they are cautious they say "look, they do care" when they don't "look they had a big picture cheshbon" etc etc.

      Why can't we just accept that they aren't diligent without justification at a major cost???

      Sheesh.

      Delete
    4. Maybe they all stand three feet apart?

      Delete
    5. Even if you have had the infection that doesn't prevent you from getting it again asymptomatically
      and transmitting it to others.

      Delete
    6. And if you get it its not the end of the world, you will get covid eventually, even if you get vaccinated

      Delete
  5. Nathan, here’s something you don’t know, because the media enjoys covering weddings, sensational and newsworthy events. Communities such as Bobov have been attending packed Shuls since September. Wedding are happening at regular venues attended by thousands, we are living life as it were in 2019. In all respects. Since our very bad March and April and a small uptick in september , there has been no outbreak or major tsunami of positives or deaths that your article would like to imply as inevitable.

    We wear no masks, ( except in the bank and in an Uber) we dance and pray all squished together, and whatever we do from a communal perspective is attended by hundreds or thousand in very tight quarters. Every. Single. Day.

    Out positivity rates are are not greater than general population, our death rates(at least since summer) aren’t either. Almost everyone we hang out with already had it and has tested for antibodies before.

    As someone from the outside, you may get all riled up that a dangerous killer event is about to happen in the community and you feel it’s important to stop it. If you’d been in Hasidic Brooklyn anytime in last couple of months you’d see that tonight is no different than Shabbos, or any random evening packed with Simchas. Your perspective only adds up if your vantage point is one with limited info and incorrect facts. It’s wonderful for the media whose audience’s info is also limited, and need content to stay in business . You should be better.

    Nothing I wrote above attempts to address any argument of Chillul Hashem, Dina demalchisa, hypocrisy, which are the subjects of many of your more legitimate articles. Just easy on “Murder” sensationalism. Leave that for the New York Post.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I'm not at all convinced that you don't have higher mortality rates. Do you have statistics? Here in Israel the charedi communities have much higher mortality rates.
      In Stamford Hill, chassidim made a similar argument, that they'd all had it already. And then a lot more died in the last few weeks.
      And the difference with a wedding like this is that you have many people from abroad. Which causes all the different strains of the virus to spread everywhere.

      Delete
    2. to date 11204 and 11219 had one of the lowest death in the city they a had 211 and 230 deaths (per 100,000) way below nyc average https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data-totals.page#zip

      Delete
    3. You can look at the data here https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data-totals.page#zip

      Deaths per capita in the Boro Park/Flatbush/Williamsburg zip codes don't seem to be higher than Brooklyn as a whole, and are lower than Queens and the Bronx. Some of that might have to do with chasidim being relatively younger.

      Delete
    4. out of 174 zip codes in NYC 11204 stand at the 102 place 11211 is 137 11206 is 117 and 11219 is at 130 all out neighborhoods our averall avrage id way better than most of the city.

      https://raw.githubusercontent.com/nychealth/coronavirus-data/master/totals/data-by-modzcta.csv

      Delete
    5. "Our positivity rates are are not greater than general population"

      Not true. I checked up the data.

      Boro Park's current positivity rate for those tested is over 10%. That's worse than NYC's average. For the the 177 zipcodes tracked by NYC Health, Boro Park ranks 139. So Boro Park is doing relatively poorly. There have been 240 people who've tested positive this past week. Sure, that's not enough for a "major tsunami" but it still adds up to needless deaths & suffering.

      Delete
    6. The chassidic population is overall much younger, so that will lower the overall mortality average. But there is a much higher mortality rate among the elderly.

      Delete
    7. Not clear that age is making such a big difference here. For example zip code 11219, Boro Park, has 207 deaths per 100000. It has 12.3% 65+. NY as whole has more than 250 deaths per 100000, and has 14.5% 65+. With just a crude ratio calculation, BP is not obviously doing worse. I would welcome a deeper analysis.

      Delete
    8. "to date 11204 and 11219 had one of the lowest death in the city they a had 211 and 230 deaths (per 100,000) way below nyc average"

      Untrue. I added the columns and divided & came up 250 for NYC. 211 & 230 are not "way below" the NYC average. Given the younger population, those figures are alarming.

      Delete
    9. the median age in 11204 is 34.7 years old compared to 36.7 for the rest of the city
      https://www.towncharts.com/New-York/Demographics/11219-Zipcode-NY-Demographics-data.html

      Delete
    10. Covid Death rates will be lower for any zip code that has a younger population. Lower does not mean covid deaths aren't happening. The more infected, the more deaths. It's really that simple. This is true whether the death rate is 0.45% in aggregate (say for a younger population with a massive 25% reduction in mortality!) or 0.6% in aggregate (say for a slightly older population). In situation 1, 1000 infections = 4 die, and in situation 2, 1000 infections will mean that 6 die.

      In every population, the more young people get infected, the more that it spreads and old people catch it from them. It's not rocket science. This is how the demographics shifted in every young person outbreak in every place in the world. These Bobovers are in denial or simply ignorant of basic facts.

      Delete
    11. The solution is simple. Tell the guest to stand some feet apart. Problem solved.

      Delete
    12. "Tell the guest to stand some feet apart. Problem solved."

      Wrong. Distancing reduces infection but doesn't eliminate it, especially indoors. And now that it's winter it's almost guaranteed that there isn't adequate ventilation in these crowded places.

      Delete
    13. Ephraim, Yes, which is why outdoors is much safer. Its the same way we do minyan. Stand six feet apart, like so. They could ware masks. There is a lot of safe ways and precautions they could take to hold the wedding, safely. I'm against people standing against each other and indoors. Outdoors would be much better.

      Delete
  6. This is disgraceful. I am truly hoping there will be a "snitch". My relatives in Brooklyn tell me mask wearing is shunned and that on Shabbos it is hard to navigate the streets as so many are maskless. The Bobovers will claim anti-Semitism if the police intervene.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. @Irwin, It might not be that bad. I've been to Trump rallies were many people are shouting and hooting. I stayed a feet apart or so. These people could try to do the same.

      And when the police intervene, it is most definitely anti-Semitism.

      Delete
  7. Not sure what intrigues me more, the fact that you really think anything has changed or will change in regards to your moronic post or the fact that you're making baseless claims and assumptions to make an invalid argument against an entire community that they're murderers.
    You have absolutely no evidence to support the claim that a secret wedding with thousands of attendees will be held, and quite frankly it proves ignorance to even think that an event involving thousands of people from all over to be held in secret.
    You even admit in your incoherent rant that you've been told the wedding will be held in private with followers celebrating from their homes, but that didn't stop you from publishing the hit piece.
    In addition to that, the fact that Coronavirus has been used as a political wand by everyone from politicians to even doctors should be perhaps enough to teach the masses to completely ignore advisories and go on with their lives as usual despite the obvious risks.
    I will never dismiss the obvious dangers Covid is. However, if we can get on packed flights for hours on end, if we can celebrate a Biden victory by the thousands without worry of mass spreading (by the same individuals making the claims and laws against mass gatherings), if we can protest (riot) for racial justice across America for days on end without worrying for Covid, If politicians can assemble in their chambers across the country (aka going to work), if we are allowed to go to major department stores with hundreds of shoppers at a time.... I can go on like this forever... Jews can assemble to practice religious freedoms and celebrate major events themselves too.
    The insane obsession against selective events, particularly Jewish events is nothing short of hypocrisy and ludicrous. You should be ashamed of yourself for jumping on the band wagon of virtue signaling trying to be on the "correct" side of a story without being on the "right" side of events.
    My suggestion; get off this site, delete your account and get a real job, engage with real people and live life the way it was meant to be before ever again attempting to take a swipe against an individual, let alone an entire community.
    I wish you all the best sincerely and a refuah shleima.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Flying is not dangerous - look up articles about the unique airflow on planes.
      The other examples that you give are likewise all much less dangerous for various reasons (outdoors with masks etc.).

      Delete
    2. You probably have not heard of Rabbi Dr. Slifkin before. His job is taking swipes against individual haredim and the entire haredi comunity,and to him that is living life the way it was meant to be.

      Delete
    3. "Jews can assemble to practice religious freedoms and celebrate major events themselves too."

      Mass weddings during a pandemic are אסור & not Judaism. It follows that participating in such events is just partying & not practicing religious freedom.

      Delete
    4. Actually, frummie, my job is running a museum, which is currently closed due to a pandemic. So I really don't like it when people prolong the pandemic.

      Delete
    5. Flying is not very dangerous, but the airport sure is

      Delete
    6. "Jews can assemble to practice religious freedoms and celebrate major events themselves too." I agree! All summer rioting was ok. Looting was ok. And Biden rallies a few days from now will be ok. Heck rioting in the US capitol is also ok, apparently. (It was antfia, that's why)! So what's wrong if a few Jews want to get married?

      Delete
    7. @Rabbi
      You only answered regarding flying in a dismissive response.
      Since your unemployed right now I’d like a detailed response refuting all of the above and especially the BLM gatherings which happened in a much more dangerous time and how you justify that.
      Also as a member of the Boro Park community I can attest that people contracting Covid right now although rarely don’t require hospitalization and are no worse off then catching a seasonal flu.
      May gd help you see the good in people no and in Jews too.

      Delete
    8. "Also as a member of the Boro Park community I can attest that people contracting Covid right now although rarely don’t require hospitalization and are no worse off then catching a seasonal flu."

      What do you mean by "rare"? One percent? Do you realize what that adds up to when hundreds are getting sick each weeks? In Israel severe/critical cases are also "rare" 1%. But that's enough to overwhelm hospitals. It's been estimated that a third of deaths in hospitals is due them being overwhelmed.

      "..especially the BLM gatherings.."
      Irrelevant. You can't kasher with a sheretz. The radical leftists also disdain life when it suits them.

      Delete
    9. Riots are always bad, and the BLM riots indeed were so, leading to destruction of property, loss of revenue etc. But a lot of them actually did wear masks! And they were outside. Sure, political bedfellows - those who "believe in science" are also those who are more sensitive to social injustice.

      Which bugs me no end. This did not HAVE to be a political thing. But those on the Right who felt that a mask was an infringement of their rights, and the religious ppl who "don't believe in science" made it a political thing. THAT in and of itself is a chillul Hashem.

      For some people, it is a bad flu. For some, it's almost nothing (including for my brother). For some, it's permanent loss of sense of smell. For some, it's blood clots, resulting in leg pain and swelling as well as loss of part of the lung or even a stroke or heart attack. For some, it's pneumonia. And for some, it's a death sentence.

      I don't know why "wearing a mask" is so hard for everybody. I don't know why all of these problems are worth having just to fight the system.

      Delete
    10. @Yosef R, I agree that riots are always bad, even the BLM riots. However, BLM did not wear masks at all. And I think the Left turned the pandemic into a political thing. Its the Left that delayed stimulus checks and enforce endless lockdowns.

      Delete
  8. Strange thing to claim the regulations are selectively enforced if at the same time important officials disregard them. I would have said they are generally loosely enforced, which puts things in a different perspective altogether. Maybe you ARE sometimes giving your prejudice free rein after all...

    ReplyDelete
  9. Almost every night we witnessed a similar thing here in Beit Shemesh living next to RBS Bet. The chassidim would have massive outdoor weddings during an actual lockdown. But what really infuriated everyone was that they would have it with the music blasting for all to hear. A massive chilul Hashem b'farhesiya. The entire country needs to lockdown in large part because their communities arent following Covid guidelines and then they flaunt their disregard for the rules.
    It goes to show you that many charedi communities will find a heter to do whatever they want. Pritzus is assur, driving on shabbos is assur, zionism is assur, but not following health guidelines that have nothing to do with tzniyus, shabbos or zionism is mutar.

    The other day I saw a "chassid" walking without wearing a mask. I said to him the following: "I find it interesting that we are very makpid not to eat fish and meat together because the gemara tells us its dangerous. Yet here we have a mamish sakana and you and your neighbors refuse to wear a mask." He looked at me and continued on his way without saying a word.

    Such hypocrisy!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. שקשה עליהם טהרת כלים יותר משפיכות דמים

      Delete
  10. PANDEMIC!

    THINK OF A VIRUS so advanced, it infects not the lungs and blood but the thoughts!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. See the book by Darrel W. Ray. ACJA

      Delete
  11. People are protected when involved in a mitzvah. Attending a simcha is not the same as when 50K people went to Dubai.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Wrong. There's no blanket leniency to engage in a מצוה when there's danger.
      היכא דשכיח היזיקא שאני

      Delete
    2. What a unbelievable and sad comment... Mamash nebech.

      Delete
    3. @Ephraim The question is if it's a danger. For 99.5% people it is no more danger that flue. It is a danger for elderly and people with conditions, who indeed should avoid contacts and not attend such events.

      Delete
    4. Lazar,
      What percentage of the population are eldery or have conditions? What percentage of them live with people who are young and don't have medical conditions?
      I've heard this trope about "shield the elderly & vulnerable" for months, but no one actually explains how. (Just like the "herd immunity" trope- is there a place with proven herd immunity? Is there a place with claimed herd immunity with low morbidity among the elderly/vulnerable?)

      You talk about 99.5% people. That's simply not true. The percentage of severe cases in Israel is 1%- (in other places that % is going to be higher). Between mild & severe there are obviously going to be non-severe cases that are going to be worse than flu. Which means you've underestimated the seriousness by more than half!

      In any case, all of this is irrelevant. You talk about the elderly/vulnerable but the fact is that Bobov didn't decree that such people & their close contacts were forbidden from appearing. They don't agree with you that they "should avoid contacts and not attend such events."

      Delete
    5. @Ephraim The percentages are based on the symptomatic cases. Random antibody tests in some counties in US showed the actual number of infected people may be several times more that reported, so survival rate is even higher. And there was no need for Bobov to ban anyone- it was a choice of everyone whether to attend or not.

      Delete
  12. I am reminded of a statement by former magician and rationalist James Randi:
    The public’s understanding of science is weak. A large percentage of those who regularly scoff at the progress science has made, would simply not be here if it were not for advances in our understanding of the world around us (and I am an excellent example of that fact) and that is exactly what science is all about. Science is part of our survival mechanism, it works, and it can be shown to work. The quacks and scam artists out there do not have a record of success, and leave behind them broken hearts, crippled bodies, and shattered dreams.

    A recent National Science Foundation survey shows that, although an overwhelming number of Americans support scientific research and government sponsorship of the same, half of the Americans surveyed were unable to answer fundamental science questions about the world around them. Historically, there has been a close relationship among perception, misperception based on “apparent” reality, and scientific knowledge derived from critical analysis. An education in the process of critical thinking investigating why we think what we think, trains students to examine the gaps and inconsistencies in their knowledge base, and to more accurately separate fact from fantasy.

    ReplyDelete
  13. Is this the "48" guys or the "45" guys? I can't keep track...

    ReplyDelete
  14. Replies
    1. What's wrong with a few Jews getting married? Rioting is ok. Insurrection in the capitol by antifa is ok. Looting is ok. What's the difference? Oh, this is a religious thing now. Ok. Now I get it.

      Delete
    2. @th you must be confusing me with somebody else. Don’t you recall my condemnation of the so called BLM protests. Anyway, you probably do not understand the Yiddish connotation especially in reference to Jews. ACJA

      Delete
    3. @ACJA, Sorry, I wasn't referring to you. I must have clicked "reply" accidentally.

      Delete
  15. Is there any evidence that the Satmar wedding two months ago attended by 7,000 people led to deaths?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Yes. We know that the virus spreads very well indoors. We know that the virus kills a small percentage of whom it infects. And we know that people who get infected can infect others. And we know that overwhelmed hospitals are forced to triage & people die.
      Tell you what: Get the invite list & track down the guest & their immediate friends & family. How are they doing?
      According to Satmarism the death rate is much higher. That's because these mass weddings are an act of rebellion, and thus violate the three oaths. According to ויואל משה, when an oath is violated, Hashem punishes even those who didn't violate the oath.

      Delete
  16. I don't know if linking a wedding to the words "murder" is kosher.

    With that same line of reasoning, why don’t you worry about cigarettes? It has been proven scientifically, not theory, that cigarettes kill both the people who smoke them and the people around them. Why don't we cry about the drugs that likewise harm and killed people? Or about pollution in the busses. Or fast food, for that matter. One cruise ship can emit as much co2 as a million cars per day! Yes, covid is dangerous, but my cousin's sister had it for only one day. Trump easily got over it. People are walking around in masks but continue to smoke endlessly.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. What a confused hodgepodge of thoughts. Here's an idea: Think first before you type.

      Delete

  17. what do you call an Israeli policemen who is trying to stop a Rebbes grand children’s wedding during the pandemic?

    A Nazi!

    https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/HJUP11vXJd#autoplay

    ReplyDelete
  18. Grand Rabbi Halberstam has had his entire community tested for antibodies before reopening his synagogue in May and is aware of exactly how many people in his community are relatively immune to the virus. Therefore, his events are planned with factual information available and he is able to carefully and responsibly plan events with medical advice

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. "Grand Rabbi Halberstam has had his entire community tested for antibodies before reopening his synagogue in May"

      I don't believe it. We haven't seen such mass pervasive testing anywhere in most countries. But prove me wrong.

      "and is aware of exactly how many people in his community are relatively immune to the virus."
      What does this mean? Does he really know how many are too many? Does he know that if x% tested + for antibodies it's sufficient? What does "relatively immune" mean? And it's not clear that having anti-bodies prevent spreading since it's understood that coronaviruses can infect the nasal passages of immune person since anti-bodies in the blood may not sufficiently reach the nasal passages- hence spread is still possible.

      You better pay attention & wake up. We were told that it was all over & now disaster looms here in Israel. 37% of new cases are Charedi. Hospitals are reporting severe cases in pregnant women (generally young without existing conditions) & young men. שערי צדק & מעיני היהושע hospitals (which are rather charedi) are close to or have passed 100% capacity. And with thousands still new reported cases daily, it will get worse for weeks. Even if the curve flattens, it will take time before the crisis is over. The math is inescapable.

      The חברי קדישא in LA are panicking- they report close to half the deaths are due to covid.

      What seems to be happening is that the new more infectious variant seems to have taken hold. Now, herd immunity depends in part on how infectious a pathogen is. That means that even if BP achieved herd immunity (a highly speculative & irresponsible claim), that's likely gone now.

      Delete
  19. One could probably argue that large weddings are in and of themselves obscene, at least as obscene as some of the stupid and foolish comments justifying this ludicrous behaviour. Sick and sad all at once and a shame that education seems so poor. Maybe its time for a post on education and weddings in general. Bracha Vehatzlacha.

    ReplyDelete
  20. Murder? If this is murder, what do you call a person with a gun walking over to an innocent child and shooting her in the head? Please let's maintain some proportionality and reason, and not give into linguistic hysterics.

    Even worse - it is not just hysterics, because words have meaning. If indeed this is a question of "murder", then you realize, Rabbi Slifkin, that the legal category of רודף is applicable.

    Do you really think that this an appropriate title?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It's an appropriate title. And RNS is not the first one. Never mind that rabbinic hyperbole is often used in places where the masses are negligent, when it comes to matters of saving lives vs. mitzvot, the ירושלמי already uses strong language: הנשאל מגונה והשואל הרי זה שופך דמים
      The same (or similar) phrase is repeated in the טור & most/all later authorities.

      In recent months I've only seen one major rabbi who disapproved of such strong language, though in that case it was a charedi editorial cartoon that depicted a covid scoffer as a "shahid" for not wearing a mask on a packed bus.

      Delete
    2. The head of |aka says that these rabbanim are worse than Holocaust Deniers
      https://www.ynet.co.il/judaism/article/B19Gh4Nyu#autoplay

      Delete
    3. This type of hyperbole leads to unclarity and hysterics. Especially from a rationalist blog, I think it is best to keep the discussion rational and measured.

      Delete
    4. Nu?? did the wedding happen? any pics?

      Delete
  21. The disregard for any safeguards is rampant in the Chassidic community. Just take a look at the pictures in the JCN Daily email and you will see many pictures, everyday, from the many rebbishe simchas where people take no safeguards and pile on top of each other. Everyday the JCN reports a big list of all upcoming events that day. If you want to try to prevent this of behavior maybe publish the list everyday.

    ReplyDelete
  22. As it happens, the original article was accurate and the revised version was a deliberate lie, as seems to be these people's modus operandi. Here are tweets documenting last night's wedding, including Benzion Halberstam dancing with someone who calls himself the Vizhnitzer Rebbe of London (it's barely worth asking how this London-based rebbe made it to the US and now presumably back to the UK):
    https://twitter.com/yaakov_melamed/status/1351539241751339008?s=20

    https://twitter.com/yaakov_melamed/status/1351436517743468545?s=20

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. And it gets worse:
      https://twitter.com/AbbyChavaStein/status/1351570355991818242?s=20

      Delete
  23. Do we need to remind these people that they don't celebrate weddings during sefirat haomer because they don't want to rejoice at a time when thousands of R'Akiva's students died as a resut of a plague.
    Just sayin'...

    ReplyDelete
  24. Wow these comments didn't age well.

    HELLO ALL THE PEOPLE THAT JUST VOICED LIES AND HATED ON THE AUTHOR BECAUSE THEY CLAIMED THAT THIS WEDDING ACTUALLY WASNT HAPPENING.

    Honestly go to hell you guys are even worse than the ones who went to that wedding. You are more complicit to the murder of innocent jews than some nazis

    ReplyDelete
  25. Perhaps it's suicide, but not murder when everyone attends voluntarily. Adopting the extreme language of your adversaries does not befit you.

    ReplyDelete

Comments for this blog are moderated. Please see this post about the comments policy for details. ANONYMOUS COMMENTS WILL NOT BE POSTED - please use either your real name or a pseudonym.

Denying the Reality of Physics

In the wake of the Meron disaster, Mishpacha magazine put a lot of thought and care into publishing appropriate responses. There are some ar...